Dance, Monkeys, Dance

[Emerald Weapon]

People believe what you want, be it creation or evolotion god or no god but one thing I will say is that the reason people don't believe in god is because they don't have faith, some people have it some don't, myself I don't but I swear if god popped in my room and said believe in me, I would become a nun (and I am a guy)

That's logic. If God were to appear to everyone on the boards when we log in and tell us that we are sinners and shut down our monitors with mere willpower, heck we'd be a Christian FF-Related forum in mere hours. (And we'd all start praying devotedly for the Q-Gears project to be finished...)
However the point your making is exactly that what religion is all about. Like L. Spiro said it's believing in something you cannot see and can only hope there is. I have lots of discussions on this with a Christian friend of mine, and he states that God could easily show himself to all beings and make them obey him. However, he does not want that because then his followers wouldn't love him. They'd worship him out of  fear not faith. Therefore he doesn't show himself but he wants you to trust him. I disagree with him on this matter. He does what many religious people do, reason in circles and pre-assume that God exists.

I've come up with a little theory of my own on Christianity. There is an explanation for everything. In Christianity there are only three things you need:

1. God's Love
2. Satan
3. Wonders

All the good in the world is God's doing out of love for his children. All the bad and wrong things are either punishment from God or the work of Satan. And everything we can't explain: Wonders. (Please feel free to attack me on this one.)

I also believe religion was invented by man for several reasons:

- The explaining of the unknown -- many of today's great religions were started quite some time ago. The world's leading one's: Christianity more than 2000 years ago, Islam 1400 years ago. People back then simply couldn't understand why certain things happened. The couldn't re-create the events themself, thus it had to be a greater power.
- Power. Very important. Religion has throughout the centuries been used as an instrument for power by many, many rulers. Both high church officials as well as worldy emperors. Religion was a binding factor and a very effective way of getting people to do your bidding. Important figures merely had to announce their decision was one of God and millions of people blindy obeyed.
- Resistance. Religion has also been used as a means of fighting the established government. Think Luther, Calvin. Many of the princes in the Holy Roman Empire (that's the same territory that we now today call Germany) used turning to protestantism as a way of legally disobeying their catholic emperor. (I'll spare you the precise dates)
- Money. To speak with South Park: "What's better than having people believe you? Having them pay your for it!". The church has always, always been rich. Both the christian as well as islamic "churches" were (and still are) a very wealthy establishment. During the Middle-Ages many bishops, cardinals and even ordinary priets had vast amounts of money, originally intended for the church.

I also have to disagree with L. Spiro on the statement that religion has to be one of the stupidest things man ever invented. Not at all, it actually is one the smartest things ever invented. An easy, cheap and fast way of having people do your bidding and paying you for it. Ofcourse nowadays things are different from the Middle-Ages, however take a look at this site: Clicky

Take a look at the numbers and be astounded. Well you probably knew, but still.

Religion has done more harm in this world than anything else. An interesting thing to do is to create a small list of the greater conflicts and wars in the world from the last, say, 50 years, and check for each one of them if and how religion was involved. You'll be amazed.

Just to point out one more thing. I also think religion can be a beautiful thing. To be so sure, to have something eternal and vastly powerful to hold on to, to experience that amount of love, it must be wonderful...

I'm just to much of a critic I guess...

 

[Thrashamatrix]

Just an idea, why doesn't someone change the subject it is more of a "Why are we here?" topic, methinks

 

[AOD]

Actually it is pretty accurate.

And as I was just discussing with my boss the night before, religion is by far the worst, stupidest thing man-kind has ever invented.

I find it quite amazing that even today, when mankind is more intelligent than it has ever been, so many people still mindlessly follow some religion or another like a bunch of clueless zombies, blindly following the teachings of their parents.  No need for proof or substantiation; just allow yourself to be brainwashed and you’ll have bliss from then forth.


We also had a deep discussion regarding those imaginary lines in the dirt.
I questioned whether the lines would ever have been drawn if mankind was as advanced then as we are now.
Long ago, mankind needed explanations for things they didn’t understand.
No congregation of humanity was different at that time; they were all seeking answers, and thus multiple religions were born.
To each group of humans, it seems the only answer for the unexplainable was to create some type of “God” in their own images who was responsible for everything they did not understand.
Thus it is very clear that if we were as advanced then as we are now, religion would never have been invented.

But the lines?
The lines mark more than just personal differences.  They mark greed.
Nearly every line people draw in the dirt was originally out of conquest.
Long long ago that was all that was on mankind’s mind.
Nobody stops to consider this.
Nobody stops to consider the idea that mankind had the wrong mindset back when they were drawing all these lines, and that 90% of all these lines need to be redrawn with actual purposes, or just eliminated.
Mankind is suffering today because of the unnatural way lines were drawn long long ago, and now the damage done is too great to reverse.
Because of the way the lines were drawn the first time, people have too much of a hardcoded mindset that that is how it should be and they just take it for granted, assuming the lines are the end-all-be-all definitive measurement of who is who.
Places such as Iraq, Iran, Palestine, Israel, and Niger are now completely lost in this concept.
Many of them are groups of people inside the same borders who drew yet more lines that aren’t on the maps.

It never occurred to them that without the lines and without religion, all those people around them are just…

…people.


L. Spiro

Some people would find that offensive i dont belive in religions i like to belive in Evolution is what created us all

 

[Sad Jari]

Some people would find that offensive, i dont.

Ok.

Belive in religions.

I would rather not.

I like to belive in Evolution is what created us all.

Wait, we were created because you like to believe in evolution? Damn.

And for crying out loud, why did you quote Spiro's entire post?

 

[odo324]

...why doesn't someone change the subject it is more of a "Why are we here?" topic...

:lol: And you used the original subject because.... ?

All the good in the world is God's doing out of love for his children. All the bad and wrong things are either punishment from God or the work of Satan. And everything we can't explain: Wonders.

Well, I can certainly understand how you came to that conclusion. :|
God is good, Satin is bad, and Unknowns are wonders created by God... Bla, bla, bla... IMO, it's a pretty normal & yet typical view at Christianity. The scary thing is the amount of Christians actually believe that to the letter!

An easy, cheap and fast way of having people do your bidding and paying you for it.

How could this view include Christianity's origins? It's true, through out history many people have used any popular religion to promote there own personal agenda. However, although it's a funny thought, who would start a religion for the sole purpose of generating money centuries later? If anything, Christianity must have been first used to promote rules and order amongst ancient civilization (aka the early tribes of Israel, depending what your views are). I would be intrested in hearing some examples, tho.

Religion has done more harm in this world than anything else.

Yet you stated earlier in your post that you 'disagree with L. Spiro on the statement that religion has to be one of the stupidest things man ever invented'. So Ur indirectly showing support for it.

why did you quote Spiro's entire post

To lazy to "cut-the-fat". Hmm, must be a programmer... We're a lazy bunch, for sure.

...mankind had the wrong mindset back when they were drawing all these lines...

Even today, drawling lines is the easiest solution to comprehend. That's why we have all sorts of countries. Drawing from your example, the separation of countries are effectively imaginary lines. So the question in this example becomes: Why do we have separate countries? Because every group has their own opinion. Religion is just one example of this phenomenon. In this sense, governments are no different. Whether religion is involved or not, there will always be imaginary lines in the sand. (I must say, that is quite an interesting concept tho.)


Note: Sorry I don't touch on any other religions. Christianity is the only one I have ever actively educated myself in.