What should I do with Red XIII, Vincent and Cait Sith?

[Shinrin]

If possible, RedXiii shouldn't use any armor or materia. Like previously mentioned, it does seem hand for him to use armor being an animal. And without the armor, where does his materia go? In his "comb"? High speed, moderate attack, high dodge, moderate defense with a high magical defense, since he's more of a mystical beast than a plain animal.

 

[The Seer of Shadows]

And without the armor, where does his materia go? In his "comb"?

Well, yeah.  If he can't equip any armor ingame, then obviously, there are no materia slots in his armor for him to utilize.  But he still has his weapons, which have materia slots for him to make use of.

Removing Red XIII's ability to equip armor will seriously limit him late in the game no matter how high his stats are.  Unlike the other characters, he'll never be able to have any elemental resistances or status immunities without the use of Resist or Shield.  I don't agree with removing his ability to equip armor, but if you do, it only makes sense to make his stat growths super uber.

What I would recommend is perhaps changing one or two pieces of armor so that they are exclusive to Red XIII.  He can have a basic piece of armor that he comes equipped with, and perhaps a better piece of armor that he can acquire later (maybe as a drop from Lifeform Hojo-N, who only drops a measly Power Source by default).

 

[Bosola]

You could give Red Elemental + Status resistances via Accessories, though. And AI, I suppose.

 

[The Seer of Shadows]

You could give Red Elemental + Status resistances via Accessories, though. And AI, I suppose.

AI is a pain to work with.  But accessories?  Why didn't I think about that?  *slaps forehead*

I still think Red should be given one special, exclusive piece of armor...

 

[Bosola]

It really isn't as bad as people imagine.

Off the top of my head, you'd

PUSH TargetMask:Self
PUSH ElementAbsorbMask:Fire
MASK
PUSH 1 (absorb)
STORE 1 in above mask
FINISH

 

[Valnus]

Seeing how both Vincent and RedXIII were experiment subjects for Hojo, they were probably exposed to some amount of mako, so they both would probably work as mages.

As a wolf monster test subject, I think RedXIII should be a high Str/Mag, low Def/MDef character.

For Vincent, as relieved in Dirge of Cerberus, he was Hojo's failed experiment, who was saved by Lucrecia by giving him Chaos cells, so I'm thinking low HP, med-low Str, high Mag and Dex, and some built in status immunities.

 

[Shankifer]

For Vincent, as relieved in Dirge of Cerberus, he was Hojo's failed experiment, who was saved by Lucrecia by giving him Chaos cells, so I'm thinking low HP, med-low Str, high Mag and Dex, and some built in status immunities.

I would also say that his Chaos forms should be handled with care, if using Valnus' idea, Making them a kind of polor opposite would probably work well, that way he can tear through regular opponents, but opponents with magical attack should be able to clear Chaos quickly, a sense of the magic energy kind of depleting the Chaos energy.

Also, I wasn't a big user of vincent during playthrough... rarely ever actually, Cloud/Barett/Red was usually my setup, but does Vincent's Limit kill Vincent if it dies, or does it just turn back into Vincent? Either way its something to think about while setting up the HP for the limits.

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

And without the armor, where does his materia go? In his "comb"?

Well, yeah.  If he can't equip any armor ingame, then obviously, there are no materia slots in his armor for him to utilize.  But he still has his weapons, which have materia slots for him to make use of.

Removing Red XIII's ability to equip armor will seriously limit him late in the game no matter how high his stats are.  Unlike the other characters, he'll never be able to have any elemental resistances or status immunities without the use of Resist or Shield.  I don't agree with removing his ability to equip armor, but if you do, it only makes sense to make his stat growths super uber.

What I would recommend is perhaps changing one or two pieces of armor so that they are exclusive to Red XIII.  He can have a basic piece of armor that he comes equipped with, and perhaps a better piece of armor that he can acquire later (maybe as a drop from Lifeform Hojo-N, who only drops a measly Power Source by default).

Letting him wear certain pieces of armour is something that I've considered. In fact, it might be necessary to do things that way; the game doesn't seem to like me making him start without any armour.

I'm considering just making him an extremely strong all-rounder to make up for an inability to equip armour. Although I'm sure that giving characters status and elemental immunities is fairly straightforward, I'm not too sure whether I want to go that way. Hmmm, would it be possible to give characters status immunities if they are at a certain level? Some AI script that checks whether they are at or above a certain level and gives immunity to, say, sudden death, when this is true?

Also, I wasn't a big user of vincent during playthrough... rarely ever actually, Cloud/Barett/Red was usually my setup, but does Vincent's Limit kill Vincent if it dies, or does it just turn back into Vincent? Either way its something to think about while setting up the HP for the limits.

He dies when his limit form dies. This is one of the (many) reasons why I really hate Vincent's limit breaks.

 

[Timu Sumisu]

for red,

-low physical def (despite equiping armor, wtv - he's a dog thing... yer hitting his hide)
-fire affinity (his bloody tail is on fire, he should have some kind of resistance etc to fire)
-fast... (he's a doggy thing... doggies are fast... i cant catch them)
-This is a bit off the wall, but i always stuck red as a blue mage, given you get the enemy skill when he is recruited, and being somewhat beastlike, i always thought of him as having an affinity to learning enemy skills. (this is long before kimari pulled it off). I dont beleive yer locking off materia, so perhaps making some way of making enemy skills more effective with red, or easier to learn (dunno how ?.?)

as to vinnie,

i like the polar opposite idea with the limit breaks. would it be possible to make them controllable? with a revert command?
going with that, i'd model vincent as being fragile but accurate/deadly, and his limits big, high hp, tough and wrecking balls

lastly cait sith, being a big toy, a tank like character seems appropriate. a higher manipulate rate seems appropriate to his character. and given he has the equiv. of a gambler job, perhaps high luck/crit chance? (limits go up an extra boost when he crits?)

I don't know how viable some of these ideas are, but tis my 2 gil.

 

[Shankifer]

I dont beleive yer locking off materia, so perhaps making some way of making enemy skills more effective with red, or easier to learn (dunno how ?.?)

I believe it was mentioned about really limiting Red's use of armor/materia. soooo....
Would it be possible to give him Enemy skill as an attack or something? you could then eliminate the need for the materia by increasing the rate of success with the attack and you wouldnt have to make it for Red only, since the materia would be obsolete.

I have no idea if this is possible or not, but I thought it would be very interesting to experiment.

 

[Bosola]

And without the armor, where does his materia go? In his "comb"?

Well, yeah.  If he can't equip any armor ingame, then obviously, there are no materia slots in his armor for him to utilize.  But he still has his weapons, which have materia slots for him to make use of.

Removing Red XIII's ability to equip armor will seriously limit him late in the game no matter how high his stats are.  Unlike the other characters, he'll never be able to have any elemental resistances or status immunities without the use of Resist or Shield.  I don't agree with removing his ability to equip armor, but if you do, it only makes sense to make his stat growths super uber.

What I would recommend is perhaps changing one or two pieces of armor so that they are exclusive to Red XIII.  He can have a basic piece of armor that he comes equipped with, and perhaps a better piece of armor that he can acquire later (maybe as a drop from Lifeform Hojo-N, who only drops a measly Power Source by default).

Letting him wear certain pieces of armour is something that I've considered. In fact, it might be necessary to do things that way; the game doesn't seem to like me making him start without any armour.

I'm considering just making him an extremely strong all-rounder to make up for an inability to equip armour. Although I'm sure that giving characters status and elemental immunities is fairly straightforward, I'm not too sure whether I want to go that way. Hmmm, would it be possible to give characters status immunities if they are at a certain level? Some AI script that checks whether they are at or above a certain level and gives immunity to, say, sudden death, when this is true?

Also, I wasn't a big user of vincent during playthrough... rarely ever actually, Cloud/Barett/Red was usually my setup, but does Vincent's Limit kill Vincent if it dies, or does it just turn back into Vincent? Either way its something to think about while setting up the HP for the limits.

He dies when his limit form dies. This is one of the (many) reasons why I really hate Vincent's limit breaks.

You can make the elemental defence contingent on *anything* mentioned in the memory map. If you look at the config / text file in Wallmarket, you can see which data - and associated addresses - you can refer to.

Here's a big list o' addresses you can access from AI:

Code: [Select]

2000|PerformedAction2008|ActionIndex2010|GlobalAddress2018|Unknown(2018)2020|CameraData2038|LimitLevel(?)2050|ActiveMask2060|Self2070|TargetMask2080|AllyMask2090|Unknown(2090)20A0|AllOpponentMask20C0|PlayerBitMask?20D0|EnemyBitMask?20E0|AllUnitsMask2110|UnknownMask2140|BattleID4000|Status:Death4001|Status:NearDeath4002|Status:Sleep4003|Status:Poison4004|Status:Sadness4005|Status:Fury4006|Status:Confu4007|Status:Silence4008|Status:Haste4009|Status:Slow400A|Status:Stop400B|Status:Frog400C|Status:Small400D|Status:SlowNumb400E|Status:Petrify400F|Status:Regen4010|Status:Barrier4011|Status:MBarrier4012|Status:Reflect4013|Status:Dual4014|Status:Shield4015|Status:D.Sentence4016|Status:Manipulate4017|Status:Berserk4018|Status:Peerless4019|Status:Paralysis401A|Status:Darkness401B|Status:DualDrain401C|Status:DeathForce401D|Status:Resist401E|Status:"LuckyGirl"401F|Status:Imprisoned4020|Flag:Invisible4021|Flag:SideAttack4022|Flag:Unknown(00000004)4023|Flag:Targetable4024|Flag:MainScriptActive4025|Flag:Defending4026|Flag:BackRow4027|Flag:Facing4028|Flag:PhysicalImmune4029|Flag:MagicalImmune402A|Flag:Unknown(00000400)402B|Flag:Unreachable402C|Flag:NoDeathAnimation402D|Flag:DeadUnit402E|Flag:Tangible402F|Flag:Unknown(00008000)4030|Flag:Unknown(00010000)4031|Flag:Unknown(00020000)4032|Flag:Unknown(00040000)4033|Flag:Unknown(00080000)4034|Flag:Unknown(00100000)4035|Flag:Unknown(00200000)4036|Flag:Unknown(00400000)4037|Flag:Unknown(00800000)4038|Flag:Unknown(01000000)4039|Flag:Unknown(02000000)403A|Flag:Unknown(04000000)403B|Flag:Unknown(08000000)403C|Flag:Unknown(10000000)403D|Flag:Unknown(20000000)403E|Flag:Unknown(40000000)403F|Flag:Unknown(80000000)4040|Index4048|Level4050|ElementalWeakness?4058|GreatestElementalDamage4060|FormationNumber4068|AttackPower4070|MagicPower4078|Evade%4080|IdleAnimID4088|DamageAnimID4090|BackDamageMult4098|SizeScale40A0|DEX40A8|LUK40B0|Unknown(40B0)40B8|AllyCovered40C0|AttackMask40D0|PreviousAttacker40E0|PreviousPhysAttacker40F0|PreviousMagAttacker4100|PhysDefense4110|MagDefense4120|EnemyID4130|AbsorbFire4131|AbsorbIce4132|AbsorbLightning4133|AbsorbEarth4134|AbsorbPoison4135|AbsorbGravity4136|AbsorbWater4137|AbsorbWind4138|AbsorbHoly4139|AbsorbRestorative413A|AbsorbCut413B|AbsorbHit413C|AbsorbPunch413D|AbsorbShoot413E|AbsorbShout413F|AbsorbHidden4140|MP4150|MMP4160|HP4180|MHP41A0|Unknown(41A0)41A8|Unknown(41A8)41B0|Unknown(41B0)41B8|Unknown(41B8)41C0|Unknown(41C0)41C8|Unknown(41C8)41D0|Unknown(41D0)41D8|Unknown(41D8)41E0|Unknown(41E0)41E8|Unknown(41E8)41F0|Unknown(41F0)41F8|Unknown(41F8)4200|Unknown(4200)4208|Unknown(4208)4210|Unknown(4210)4218|Unknown(4218)4220|InitialStatus:Death4221|InitialStatus:NearDeath4222|InitialStatus:Sleep4223|InitialStatus:Poison4224|InitialStatus:Sadness4225|InitialStatus:Fury4226|InitialStatus:Confu4227|InitialStatus:Silence4228|InitialStatus:Haste4229|InitialStatus:Slow422A|InitialStatus:Stop422B|InitialStatus:Frog422C|InitialStatus:Small422D|InitialStatus:SlowNumb422E|InitialStatus:Petrify422F|InitialStatus:Regen4230|InitialStatus:Barrier4231|InitialStatus:MBarrier4232|InitialStatus:Reflect4233|InitialStatus:Dual4234|InitialStatus:Shield4235|InitialStatus:D.Sentence4236|InitialStatus:Manipulate4237|InitialStatus:Berserk4238|InitialStatus:Peerless4239|InitialStatus:Paralysis423A|InitialStatus:Darkness423B|InitialStatus:DualDrain423C|InitialStatus:DeathForce423D|InitialStatus:Resist423E|InitialStatus:"LuckyGirl"423F|InitialStatus:Imprisoned4240|Unknown(4240)4248|Unknown(4248)4250|Unknown(4250)4258|Unknown(4258)4260|Unknown(4260)4268|MagEvade%4270|BattleRow4278|Unknown(4278)4280|ReturnedGil4290|ReturnedItem42A0|NullFire42A1|NullIce42A2|NullLightning42A3|NullEarth42A4|NullPoison42A5|NullGravity42A6|NullWater42A7|NullWind42A8|NullHoly42A9|NullRestorative42AA|NullCut42AB|NullHit42AC|NullPunch42AD|NullShoot42AE|NullShout42AF|NullHidden42B0|AP42C0|Gil42E0|Exp4300|Unknown(4300)4308|Unknown(4308)4310|Unknown(4310)4318|Unknown(4318)4320|Unknown(4320)4328|Unknown(4328)4330|Unknown(4330)4338|Unknown(4338)

The last ones are all BattleVars.

 

[drfeelgud88]

Vincent should be immune to statuses like death, petrification, etc. I mean, he's a powerful vampire-like life form.

 

[SeviStatic]

vincent could also auto-drain like 5% of his attack damage as HP.  and maybe a script that auto-resurrects him with low hp when he dies in limit form