What Went Wrong?

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The problem I have is that the "linear" argument is just a diversion to the other faults of XIII...  before its release all I heard was "linear".  I didn't realise it was gonna be literally a gauntlet... but I was more bothered with the aspects that weren't mentioned... the incredibly bad pacing, the cutscene checkpoints, the lack of any real towns or diversions or puzzles or minigames or NPC... just mindless fighting on a gauntlet, then 1 open area and no going back.

I object to X being made out to be XIII  :)
 
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Again most of those things are true, but if we're talking about how linear the game is, it's very similar to how linear X was. That's all I'm saying. There are obviously other things about XIII that make it a worse game than X, but they're still both similarly linear in the same way.
 
To be fair though, despite any illusion of freedom, all FF games are completely linear by most accounts.
Although you can sidetrack a few times, you're always on a one-way railroad track towards the end - There are no alternative routes(except in a few limited ways, like in the Shinra HQ), and no alternative endings. The only "non-linear" elements of the earlier games is a very few side-quests, and the ability to backtrack or dally around old spots - But you can't advance lest you move back on track.

Still, I agree that it's a stretch to compare FF10 with FF13. FF10 stripped away the world map - But that's basically it.
FF13 stripped away almost everything else that people consider the core elements of any good Jrpg.

As for Last Story - It's god damn amazing IMO.
It's the only next-gen j-rpg made since the end of the PS2 era that I consider worth mentioning at all in comparison to the old giants(FF6-10, Suikoden 1-2, Xenogears, BoF3-4, Vandal Hearts, Alundra, Chrono Trigger/Cross etc).
In fact, I consider it even better than some of the old classics.
It's the only Jrpg, where I haven't hated a single character from the main cast, and had no grudges with neither story nor gameplay.
The only drawback for me, was that it could have been longer and more massive in scale - But you can't have it all.
 
Still, I agree that it's a stretch to compare FF10 with FF13. FF10 stripped away the world map - But that's basically it.
FF13 stripped away almost everything else that people consider the core elements of any good Jrpg.
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Exactly.  You speak Japanese no (to play Last Story)?
 
Yes. I speak fluently(still struggling with Kanji though).
Worth mentioning that Last Story is pretty basic in its presentation so even the average anime fan should be able to get through it and grasp the gist of it(more or less everything fully voice-acted, semi-English menus, and all relevant information like item-names and place-names are usually related in katakana). Gameplay is also pretty straight forward to the point that it plays out intuitively for long standing jrpg fans as well.

I'd advise anyone to give it a try regardless of the language barrier. When I played my first FF game, I couldn't read English fluently, and back then there was no voice-overs to aid the effort - I managed it pretty well - So playing Last Story shouldn't prove that much of a challenge to most people I think.

Playing that game I think I realized how much effect Sakaguchi probably has had over the years on ensuring the quality of the FF games. It's one of my all-time favourite games, and it's the only game he has made since  FF5, where he has been both director, and original concept designer at the same time, which seems to confirm the relation between Sakaguchis level of involvement and the quality of games being made :P

I'm almost willing to bet that if he got back control of the FF franchise, we wouldn't have to wait for much more than a year, until we saw a FF game with the old magic revived - But then that's not going to happen - So screw Square-Enix.
 
I have to say I actually loved FFX the world was immersive the NPC's didn't seem fake, I thought the main characters were all great (which is rare for me especially given that it had voice acting) and hunting for treasure chests is one of my many joys in Final Fantasy games.

As for Tidus, I hated him for nearly the whole story, the part when the Fayth tells him he is a dream and he just acts the same I respect him for that. I know a lot of people hate Tidus but c'mon he had more of a personality than Squall, I hated that guy and all his dots.

Also as for the FFX was the decline of the FF series, I have to completely disagree while it had some elements that were shared by 12 it had far more shared by those that came before it. FFX-2 never happened its easier on my heart that way.

As pointed out by a few people FFX seems linear because it does not have a world map and while this may seem like a bad thing to many (including myself) it certainly has it's perks, I couldn't imagine FFX with a world map now because they would have had to remove the great looking nature trails. While I love the exploration of a world map I believe having these kind of "zones" sucks you into the world.

FFXII on the other hand scrapped away with the battle system interesting NPC's and story, while you can argue it had political story I do not believe a game where you can remove the main character and the story will remain unchanged can claim to have a good story.
 
I know a lot of people hate Tidus but c'mon he had more of a personality than Squall, I hated that guy and all his dots.
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...Whatever.
 
I liked squall, the whole point of his character was that he was a sociopath.  Sociopaths do not go round partying and rave dancing.   It was a good story.  All the stories of FF were decent up to X in my view, and after that they got sloppy and amateurish.  Just like the standard.  :)
 
Speaking of FFVIII what the hell was with NORG? It wasn't only me that noticed that it came up from no-where, was accepted by all characters without questions and was never spoken of again was it?
 
yeah that one was baffling I agree...  norg was the founder and recluse of garden... he formed it with Martine if I recall...  But he just pops up one day as "oh yeah, this dude lives in the basement and he is the owner"  He is mentioned again in certain NPC Shumi discussions.

Parts of ff8 were really well done, others were sloppy and forced.  Same with IX and Necron.

I dunno why they localised it to NORG and not just Norg or Nog.
 
I have to ssay my most hates part of 8 is when they find out they were all childhood friends, Why didn't any of them recognise eachother? It was too cliche' and coincidental for my liking. But I agree 8 had some amazing moments.
 
I liked squall, the whole point of his character was that he was a sociopath.  Sociopaths do not go round partying and rave dancing.   It was a good story.  All the stories of FF were decent up to X in my view, and after that they got sloppy and amateurish.  Just like the standard.  :)
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I loved Squall. But he was in no way a sociopath! Hahaha. I think you've misused the word there. Look up the clinical definition of sociopath. I agree he had anti social qualities in the beginning of the game, but that was a completely forced/ fake attitude to deal with the abandonment complex.

The point of Squall's character is that he's in emotional turmoil from the very beginning but maintains his composure to focus. He is able to do this by keeping himself seperate from everyone, but then is surrounded by people who wear him down. Cracks start to show in his lone wolf resolve. He meets Rinoa, he becomes the leader of Balamb Garden. Shit goes down with Rinoa. Walls come down, very very emotional person. Almost the complete opposite of sociopathic, though I can see why someone who didn't properly know what it meant would think that.


yeah that one was baffling I agree...  norg was the founder and recluse of garden... he formed it with Martine if I recall...  But he just pops up one day as "oh yeah, this dude lives in the basement and he is the owner"  He is mentioned again in certain NPC Shumi discussions.

Parts of ff8 were really well done, others were sloppy and forced.  Same with IX and Necron.

I dunno why they localised it to NORG and not just Norg or Nog. 
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There are bits in every FF that are really well done or sloppy and forced IMO, though it's subjective.
 
I have to ssay my most hates part of 8 is when they find out they were all childhood friends, Why didn't any of them recognise eachother? It was too cliche' and coincidental for my liking. But I agree 8 had some amazing moments.
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again yeah, that is 1 of the usual hates of VIII and one I have to agree with.  They explain it away by saying the GF give people amnesia, and that Irvine remembered because he hadnt used GF that often.  It was poor exposition and writing there.

I also didn't like how light bulb head turned up at the very end...  it was completely unnecessary.

On the plus side, the garden battle goes down as my favourite ever single moment in a Final Fantasy.  The music, graphics, and story there were well executed.  Plus Seifer is brilliant.  Always.
 
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Too true the garden fight was one of my favourite ever final fantasy moments. The others being FFIX where Zidane turns into a loner, all of FFX's Rikku doggy paddle moments, FF7 Cloud beating on Aeris - Aerith in the temple. and the Gondola with Tifa scene in FF7.
 
I also remember wakka makin me laugh blaming al bhed for everything.

reminds me, anyone got an official release of The Landing being performed by orchestra?
 
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I loved FF8, but at the same time had some really serious beef with it - First and foremost the GF/battle system.
I might have "misapplied it", but seriously, the first time I played the game, every battle was either (1) A massive draw-fest for stocking up on magic, or (2) Spamming GFs while using boost to deal with HP heavy enemies - Which meant that every singel battle ever fought was a chore and extremely boring.
Also, limit break system was retarded. I went through most of the game without getting a limit break even once(the only games that did limit break right IMO was FF7 and FF10).

My second beef with it was the lack of impact your choices for Squalls dialogue made in terms of personalizing the character -
I mean, every time you had a nice comeback, and a rude comback, it didn't matter what you chose, because Squall would ultimately revert to "whatever... I was just kidding" or something to that effect, and nullify the choice I just made.

My third beef was have the plot ultimately got butchered over time - Going from awesome(to the ending of the first disk), to wtf(from the prison scene and onwards).
As mentioned, the memory loss + childhood friends thing, strange new enemies popping out from nowhere(Norg, every witch except Edea), and a few a bit too convenient plot devises(like the discovery of ragnarok).
Sometimes, I'm almost(just almost ok) convinced the guys who made the "Squall is actually in a coma"-theory were right, because it's so sketchy at times.

My fourth beef was that I didn't find the enemies imposing or scary. FF7 did a great job in presenting the bad guys, surrounding them with mystery and giving you the feeling that you didn't amount to shit in comparison. I remember actually being worried about catching up to Sephiroth after the Nibelheim flashback, because I knew he'd own my party and I'd have to start all over again, or something to that effect, because I hadn't levelled enough or missed out on some necessary materias etc.
Jenova was creepy as hell - The Shinra building scene was like taken out of Resident Evil.
Ultimately, witches with large breast relying solely on magic that I can counter with reflect, isn't very scary.

But FF8 had great graphics, great soundtrack, Laguna(which is arguably the must human of all FF characters), some real beautiful and creative locations - And overall good style - So it's still one of the best overall IMO.

My two favourite FFs are 7 and 10. I think there is just something about the pacing and presentation of those two that I think stands out in comparison to the rest of the series.
 
I agree 7 and 10 are the ones I place first and 2nd as well...  8-)  I liked the junction system though and I didn't mind the limit system. I also loves the GF's :P  The draw system could have been better thought out.

Soundtrack wise, 8.

I also thought 8 had a great ending, especially the causality loop angle.  Its final dungeon was great too... real fun!  8 had some real strengths in the game play department and was none too shabby in story aside from some issues.
 
I watched my brother play some of XIII the other night, and it reminded me of this hotwheels game I used to have on my computer; go foward, go foward, go foward.

Haha and the shops were some kind of little floating thing, like a save point? What........

And I remember being in like 5th grade christmas morning with my brand new ps2 and popping in X... when I got to that cutscene at the beginning with the song by the black mages and auron looking out over toward sin.

OMG. hahaha
 
The only thing I really disliked about VIII was the being unable to return to any towns after disc 3 part. Not that any of them were super duper interesting, but it was always nice in VII before knowing the game inside out to be able to go back and hear random opinions on current events XD.
 
as you prob know that was a limitation with the disc space :( same with ff9.  They prob shut off parts to compensate for ending FMV... or at the least, thought they would need the space.
 
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