P
PitBrat
Guest
Oh, derogatory terms are my favorite: pig, douche, scumbag, pussy, tool, shithead, asswipe, psycho, sicko, twit, gimp, bitch, coward, wimp . . .
[FF7PC-98] Beacause - FF7 Retranslation (Merged into Reunion, use that instead)
- Status
D
DLPB_
Guest
of those:
Most cannot be used in VII either because they are too strong or because they do not fit character. Douche would never be spoken by these characters and I think would come across as silly for example. Pig and a few others are already used. Bitch among them. The point isn't just coming up with swear words, it is coming up with words or insults that will fit the character and how it is intended. Bastard works a lot of the time but can't use it too often.
I have corrected this one :
originally I had it as:
original game has it as:
Shame about this scene is it is possibly a double entendre.... he says something like "I feel it is coming on hard", intending to be that his fist (?) is clenching or that he is ready to fight at same time as the obvious innuendo. That can't work in the English, hence why the original game sounds so awkward. He is mainly talking about how he feels Cloud, getting in his way, is going to be the one getting the fight. Originally, it sounds like he thinks there is going to be a fight elsewhere, which makes absolutely no sense and is another of FF7's "wtf" moments.
The original translation largely got away with needing to think intelligently about the use of insults because it always used the cop out %^^#^#$^^
Last edited:
P
Prince Lex
Guest
"Get lost" is definitely the better of the choices there IMO. We don't even say "do one" in Scotland, it's a purely mid/southern English thing.
K
knightsoftheround
Guest
So happy to be able to read Cid like he's supposed to sound! I know the guy is far from polite, but the constant use of #@*($&# bugged the hell out of me.
D
DLPB_
Guest
Are there any other ways to mix up the phrase by barrett "Those Shin-Ra [insert word]"
I have arseholes, bastards, scum [rearranged sentence], murderers. Can't remember any others but as you can see that's rather limited. I wonder how it works in real life. I guess people just repeat the same stuff but don't realise it?
Cid is so much easier... because he uses shit all the time, bastard, son of a bitch, piss, and the odd stronger... its not as hard to mix it up as it is with Barrett and his "Those Shin-Ra x"
Last edited:
K
knightsoftheround
Guest
I think that's actually enough, just be cautious you don't fall into a rythym. Like don't be Option A, B, C, D, A, B, C... shake it up as much as possible you know A BB D A D C C A B DDD A etc. Random like. Which you're probably already planning on doing.
Real people don't think about context this much to my knowledge, but things like aholes (I'm not sure if you mean arseholes or aholes) is stronger than the others, so maybe limit it to certain stronger contexts. Murderers is another one that may be a little more context tied than bastard or scum.
Just my two cents.
EDIT: Man this conversation is hard to have with the forum's automatic censoring. XD
Real people don't think about context this much to my knowledge, but things like aholes (I'm not sure if you mean arseholes or aholes) is stronger than the others, so maybe limit it to certain stronger contexts. Murderers is another one that may be a little more context tied than bastard or scum.
Just my two cents.
EDIT: Man this conversation is hard to have with the forum's automatic censoring. XD
D
DLPB_
Guest
Arseholes becomes assholes if you select the american option in the installer 8) I have done a degree thinking in that respect.
No I don't intend to go through random changes, but sometimes it would be good to have a degree of leeway.
No I don't intend to go through random changes, but sometimes it would be good to have a degree of leeway.
K
knightsoftheround
Guest
Oooh, it's a British/English thing. I just thought arseholes was possibly an attempt to get around Qhimm's censorship of a-doubles-holes.
D
DLPB_
Guest
Yup, we use arse! I have no idea why we differ there with America ;D I am not getting censored, so I suppose there is an option somewhere to disable it? Check your options.
D
DLPB_
Guest
Ah ok, this is one for those who have played or seen the original Japanese text. I cannot be 100% sure, but it seems that the "scream" Bugenhagen talks about is a scream that is picked up from ALL heavenly bodies in space. For example the planet screams and so does meteor:
If it does refer to all heavenly bodies like this, a better name for this scream for a non Japanese audience, may be "Celestial Scream". I need input here, especially from the likes of Hian.
The Japanese use a kanji that is both Planet and Star.
If it does refer to all heavenly bodies like this, a better name for this scream for a non Japanese audience, may be "Celestial Scream". I need input here, especially from the likes of Hian.
A
Antonia
Guest
Me either, but I find it a shame. I always thought arse worked better somehow, but if I say it that way I tend to get weird looks.
Top Commands: Profile > (Select either Account Settings or Forum Profile). Once there, a second line of top commands will pop up. From those, select Modify Profile > Look and Layout.
Down around the sixth tick box or so is an option to Leave Words Uncensored. Tick that, save via the Change Profile button near the bottom right.
Should fix it up.
Back more to the topic...
In general, I find most people do tend to be fairly repetitive in their trends where obscenities are concerned. We don't tend to notice it nearly so much, because it's not too often that someone will repeat the same thing again and again within a given time frame. Occasionally though, you'll run into someone who does, say after they've had one or two too many in the pub, and if you listen to them, they'll often just use the same words and phrases over and over.
I'd say go ahead and just fill in what seems to "feel best" for now, and wait until it actually reads out as people play through. If things start feeling too repetitive, it should be pretty easy to make a few amendments then. It's probably far more noticeable for you than it would be in play, simply because you've got to sift through all these instances more or less all at once.
In reference to the star/planet thing... I'd tend to agree you're on the right track there, and (to me) celestial scream already sounds much better. Though this is purely my opinion and speculation, as I haven't played the game in Japanese, nor can I read kanji, sadly.
Last edited:
D
DLPB_
Guest
Luksy mentioned "Cosmic Scream" this may work even better than mine.
Let's take a vote! Unless someone has any other ideas?
Cosmic Scream or Celestial Scream, noting of course that we are talking about "heavenly bodies" like planets, moons, suns, and meteors.
(also in other news, I found a spelling mistake I had made in highwind dialogue... "dieing" DOH!)
Let's take a vote! Unless someone has any other ideas?
Cosmic Scream or Celestial Scream, noting of course that we are talking about "heavenly bodies" like planets, moons, suns, and meteors.
(also in other news, I found a spelling mistake I had made in highwind dialogue... "dieing" DOH!)
Last edited:
A
Antonia
Guest
After a bit of thinking it through, I think I like cosmic better there than celestial, though I find either would probably work fine.
I definitely think both of them would be better than star/planet.
Also, it's been a while, so I can't recall the original English translation we were handed for that segment, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that the code bit above is the direct re-translation from the Japanese?
Seemed like the first form I saw it in (the "official" English translation) it read more like:
Tifa: A scream from the planet?
...Meteor?
But that's based on memory from quite a ways back... Either way, where I'm going with this is, I wonder if in the last line, she should perhaps say "the planet" rather than "our planet"?
Seems like from what I remember, most people in the FF7-verse would say 'the' rather than 'our', which also tends to better mirror real life speech here on Earth. There would certainly be times and context where specifying 'our' might be appropriate, but it seems in general, most people use the perhaps arrogant assumption that 'our' planet is really the only one worth talking about, so 'the' generally suffices and sounds a bit more natural. Just a thought.
I definitely think both of them would be better than star/planet.
Also, it's been a while, so I can't recall the original English translation we were handed for that segment, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that the code bit above is the direct re-translation from the Japanese?
Seemed like the first form I saw it in (the "official" English translation) it read more like:
Tifa: A scream from the planet?
...Meteor?
But that's based on memory from quite a ways back... Either way, where I'm going with this is, I wonder if in the last line, she should perhaps say "the planet" rather than "our planet"?
Seems like from what I remember, most people in the FF7-verse would say 'the' rather than 'our', which also tends to better mirror real life speech here on Earth. There would certainly be times and context where specifying 'our' might be appropriate, but it seems in general, most people use the perhaps arrogant assumption that 'our' planet is really the only one worth talking about, so 'the' generally suffices and sounds a bit more natural. Just a thought.
D
DLPB_
Guest
it is that Bugenhagen picks up the "scream". At first I thought scream was just from their own planet, but Tifa seems to make it clear that Meteor can also have a scream...
It doesn't look as bad in Japanese because the kanji used can be both planet AND star. And probably has a wider range. It could also be that it really is "Planet Scream" intended. We need some conclusion to that question.
It doesn't look as bad in Japanese because the kanji used can be both planet AND star. And probably has a wider range. It could also be that it really is "Planet Scream" intended. We need some conclusion to that question.
Last edited:
I
InuRa
Guest
First let me say I really like the idea of this project, even tho I might not agree with every single point presented, I do with almost all of them.
When it comes to the plot, it really felt like some things didn't link flawlessly so I'm hoping that when this project it's completed, everyone will get the chance to experience a more details and accurate story.
The point I don't agree on, it's basically spell related, like "Poisona", sure, it wasn't 100% accurate, but "Poison Null" doesn't accurately describe what it does either (maybe "Poison Nullifier" or "Antidote" would, but it would not be accurate right?). Also translating the ones that are widespread through the whole series might cause unnecessary confusion, especially to the players whose main language is not English, or still have some troubles with some less common expressions or meanings.
Regarding the most sensitive ones like Moogle and Cactuar... well at this point there is no fighting it anymore, plus it's not like the whole pronunciation was lost.
But; after going through the google docs table\sheet (just a quick look, didn't actually go into much detail at all) I have a few "questions" (or suggestions\fixes?)
One or two might have been answered before, as I didn't read the whole thread, so please ignore that one if that's the case I guess.
(Disclaimer: english is not my main lang. either, so if you see any mistake please cut me some slack
)
1163 Jammer Armor Shouldn't it be like this since it's an US translation...?
1832 Double Shield Throw Keep it like this for consistency with other doubles? Or is it not a double? Don't remember this one and there is no description.
1940 Raise For consistency with other titles this sounds fair but....
1941 Revive \ Raise II Again, not sure if this goes with the plan, but it would surely fill the spot well.
1957 Mini Decreases not only size, but also and atk power, also not to be confused with 2050 or... 2257? Plus it's widespread...
2090 Dexterity Consistency with other titles, Agility is usually associated with evasion no?
2168 Vegetable Store Isn't greengrocer not very... "US english".
2199 Please enter a name. Ponctuation was present in JP.
2267 Damage = Time x 30 Ponctuation was not present in JP and it looks better this way
1787-1791 Some have the "from" capitalized, some don't. Consistency? Check 1303 too?
Also, if you're following the Official Establishment Guide, you're gonna have to change Barret to Barett, otherwise you're just contradicting yourselves or opening the possibility of chancing the others back as well except for Aerith. And it's not like english has a different sound for "rr" right?
Had a few more and the usual "Esuna", "Poisona", "Hi-Potion" and stuff, but these are more than enough for now.
Also it would be nice if the document could be expanded to the other "official" languages. It could help them improve their own and also use them to cross-reference the translation (if they were not translated directly from JP that is).
When it comes to the plot, it really felt like some things didn't link flawlessly so I'm hoping that when this project it's completed, everyone will get the chance to experience a more details and accurate story.
The point I don't agree on, it's basically spell related, like "Poisona", sure, it wasn't 100% accurate, but "Poison Null" doesn't accurately describe what it does either (maybe "Poison Nullifier" or "Antidote" would, but it would not be accurate right?). Also translating the ones that are widespread through the whole series might cause unnecessary confusion, especially to the players whose main language is not English, or still have some troubles with some less common expressions or meanings.
Regarding the most sensitive ones like Moogle and Cactuar... well at this point there is no fighting it anymore, plus it's not like the whole pronunciation was lost.
But; after going through the google docs table\sheet (just a quick look, didn't actually go into much detail at all) I have a few "questions" (or suggestions\fixes?)
One or two might have been answered before, as I didn't read the whole thread, so please ignore that one if that's the case I guess.
(Disclaimer: english is not my main lang. either, so if you see any mistake please cut me some slack
)1163 Jammer Armor Shouldn't it be like this since it's an US translation...?
1832 Double Shield Throw Keep it like this for consistency with other doubles? Or is it not a double? Don't remember this one and there is no description.
1940 Raise For consistency with other titles this sounds fair but....
1941 Revive \ Raise II Again, not sure if this goes with the plan, but it would surely fill the spot well.
1957 Mini Decreases not only size, but also and atk power, also not to be confused with 2050 or... 2257? Plus it's widespread...
2090 Dexterity Consistency with other titles, Agility is usually associated with evasion no?
2168 Vegetable Store Isn't greengrocer not very... "US english".
2199 Please enter a name. Ponctuation was present in JP.
2267 Damage = Time x 30 Ponctuation was not present in JP and it looks better this way
1787-1791 Some have the "from" capitalized, some don't. Consistency? Check 1303 too?
Also, if you're following the Official Establishment Guide, you're gonna have to change Barret to Barett, otherwise you're just contradicting yourselves or opening the possibility of chancing the others back as well except for Aerith. And it's not like english has a different sound for "rr" right?
Had a few more and the usual "Esuna", "Poisona", "Hi-Potion" and stuff, but these are more than enough for now.
Also it would be nice if the document could be expanded to the other "official" languages. It could help them improve their own and also use them to cross-reference the translation (if they were not translated directly from JP that is).
Last edited:
D
DLPB_
Guest
Well first, thank you for taking an interest in this project. I should have made a post that we have finished discussing a lot of what you have queried, but you have no way to know that so I will respond to it properly. I am also recovering from a severe hang over, so forgive me if I sound a little ratty.
If you chose US spellings and it still said Armour, that is a problem.
We looked carefully at ALL sources and we don't have a rigid "that says it is so it has to be" approach. The OEF may
still be wrong on a few things but Barrett is nearly always spelled Barrett. Look on google at people with the name.
Also note that he is likely named after Barrett Firearms. When looking at it like that, common sense superseded the
OEF. With written proof of spelling from the writers, this decision can be reversed.
The vast majority of things with this translation are not being changed now. I have gone over everything 10x and I am happy with how it is. The latest update as part of the Menu Project is a major update on what went before.
Poison Null is fine, is close to the Japanese, and fits. Poison Nullifier does not fit and Antidote is an item. I am not changing the names I have for them now... it is 99% solidified. The only change I may make here in future would be to call it "Null Poison" or some variant.
The installer allows you to keep Moogle and Megalixir etc. The option is there for the most common so called "canon"
It isn't a US translation, it is a UK with the installer allowing you to choose US spellings.
If you chose US spellings and it still said Armour, that is a problem.
This was changed if i recall to "Double Shield"
No agility is speed, which is what this is.
I am not sure... Does anyone see Greengrocer as non US?
I got rid of it. It is not needed there.
This is a SPOKEN sentence, and so has a full stop.2267 Damage = Time x 30 Ponctuation was not present in JP and it looks better this way
Yeah that's an error. I have corrected it. Thanks
I made an exception here as I feel more sure that this is a mistake with the OEF, just like Leviathan is in there.
We looked carefully at ALL sources and we don't have a rigid "that says it is so it has to be" approach. The OEF may
still be wrong on a few things but Barrett is nearly always spelled Barrett. Look on google at people with the name.
Also note that he is likely named after Barrett Firearms. When looking at it like that, common sense superseded the
OEF. With written proof of spelling from the writers, this decision can be reversed.
I have no interest in other languages, and I don't know other languages. If people want to take our work, give full credit and translate from our work, I have no issue with it.
The vast majority of things with this translation are not being changed now. I have gone over everything 10x and I am happy with how it is. The latest update as part of the Menu Project is a major update on what went before.
Last edited:
D
DLPB_
Guest
I will also make a note here. Queries about non dialogue are no longer supported here unless there is a spelling mistake or grammar mistake. I am happy with the non dialogue and it is unlikely to be changing again. Dialogue is the order of the day now, and help with that at the end is welcome. Or corrections to spelling etc up to where we are at.
But non dialogue is now finalised. There will be no further major changes.
Canon queries are also not supported from here on. We have made the decisions on what to keep and it is final. The installer does allow you to keep the original canon names and series canon items and American spellings but that is all.
Any further issues not relating to actual dialogue should only be brought up if there is a spelling or grammar issue. The only exception to this is corrections to non dialogue listed in red and monsters in red/green. Those that we are not sure of.
But non dialogue is now finalised. There will be no further major changes.
Canon queries are also not supported from here on. We have made the decisions on what to keep and it is final. The installer does allow you to keep the original canon names and series canon items and American spellings but that is all.
Any further issues not relating to actual dialogue should only be brought up if there is a spelling or grammar issue. The only exception to this is corrections to non dialogue listed in red and monsters in red/green. Those that we are not sure of.
Last edited:
K
knightsoftheround
Guest
Greengrocer is very non-US, at least in my experience with the language. I think I've heard of it in Britain and in less than reliable translations from Japanese (the first Dogz game used it and I would have had no idea what they were talking about without the context.)
D
DLPB_
Guest
I will add the change to US spellings. 8)
K
knightsoftheround
Guest
On Cosmic vs Celestial - I'm leaning towards Cosmic.
Celestial does seem a little bit more like it would be more accurate (the term "celestial bodies") but there's a flow factor to consider too. Cosmic Scream /sounds/ better to me, and they also feel fairly close on meaning.
I think either would work so it may come down to going with what sounds best in your ear.
That's not a very helpful opinion, sorry!
Celestial does seem a little bit more like it would be more accurate (the term "celestial bodies") but there's a flow factor to consider too. Cosmic Scream /sounds/ better to me, and they also feel fairly close on meaning.
I think either would work so it may come down to going with what sounds best in your ear.
That's not a very helpful opinion, sorry!
- Status