You're american, so you fear nothing

[pyrozen]

Fourthly, the Europeans saved your arse in the American war of independence. I bet they don't teach that in American history classes, do they? All of those people whining that Americans don't get praised enough for profiting from selling weapons to the Europeans in WWII don't acknowledge that they wouldn't have stood a chance against the British without the support of several major European powers. They don't even know that they got any help. So the next time you complain about the Europeans being ungrateful, just remember that you would be singing "God Save the Queen" if it weren't for the French. The French. Goddamn, that's embarrassing. ;D

shhhhh.... we're trying our hardest to keep that one under the rug

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

Fourthly, the Europeans saved your arse in the American war of independence. I bet they don't teach that in American history classes, do they? All of those people whining that Americans don't get praised enough for profiting from selling weapons to the Europeans in WWII don't acknowledge that they wouldn't have stood a chance against the British without the support of several major European powers. They don't even know that they got any help. So the next time you complain about the Europeans being ungrateful, just remember that you would be singing "God Save the Queen" if it weren't for the French. The French. Goddamn, that's embarrassing. ;D

shhhhh.... we're trying our hardest to keep that one under the rug

Too bad. You've been letting a lot of things slip recently. ;D

 

[Opine]

well what america stands for and what it has turned into are 2 different things. The f*cking liberals conservatives have raped this country and all the morals the founders stood for. I agree if you hate america now, but don't hate on americans, because most of them who matter don't meddle in politics, and ruin this country.

ITA

 

[Covarr]

well what america stands for and what it has turned into are 2 different things. The f*cking liberals conservatives politicians in general, and the two party system have raped this country and all the morals the founders stood for. I agree if you hate america now, but don't hate on americans, because most of them who matter don't meddle in politics, and ruin this country.

ITA

Fixed fo' realz.

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

well what america stands for and what it has turned into are 2 different things. The f*cking liberals conservatives have raped this country and all the morals the founders stood for. I agree if you hate america now, but don't hate on americans, because most of them who matter don't meddle in politics, and ruin this country both the Democrats and the Republicans are completely insane ideological extremists who have contributed equally to destroying everything the founding fathers fought for with their stupidity and closed-minded tunnel vision

ITA

ITA

Not that British politics are any better. In fact, they're worse. US politics may have weird false dichotomies and a two-party system in which said two parties have arbitrary policies, but at least you have a choice. Here, the main parties are more-or-less indistinguishable. Whenever a party introduces a policy that the population hates, the opposition falls over itself to agree with them.

The Iraq war is an example. The people were against it, but both main parties supported it. In the 2004 presidential election, people who were against it had the choice to vote for Kerry and stand a good chance of seeing him win. In the 2005 British general election, we'd be stuck with a pro-war party either way.

The current government copied from Blair, who in turn copied from the Tories. We have Tories pretending to be Labour pretending to be Tories.

EDIT:

fuck you, ninja Covarr! ;D

 

[guitar_dudester91]

Well its a little hard to argue with a bunch of english ninnies about something none of us experienced. Clearly thinking I had any chance of successfully arguing a point with people who hate Americans with a passion wasn't the right thing to do. It does make me wonder what a Marine would have to say about any of it.

 

[Bosola]

ninnies

MeOW!

 

[sl1982]

Well its a little hard to argue with a bunch of english ninnies about something none of us experienced. Clearly thinking I had any chance of successfully arguing a point with people who hate Americans with a passion wasn't the right thing to do. It does make me wonder what a Marine would have to say about any of it.

Something about jackwagons i reckon.

 

[guitar_dudester91]

Well its a little hard to argue with a bunch of english ninnies about something none of us experienced. Clearly thinking I had any chance of successfully arguing a point with people who hate Americans with a passion wasn't the right thing to do. It does make me wonder what a Marine would have to say about any of it.

Something about jackwagons i reckon.

Haha well an Ex-Marine therapist wasn't exactly what I had in mind.

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

Well its a little hard to argue with a bunch of english ninnies about something none of us experienced. Clearly thinking I had any chance of successfully arguing a point with people who hate Americans with a passion wasn't the right thing to do.

And it's more than a little hard to argue with someone whose knowledge of history is taken from Jerry Bruckheimer films. ;D

But yeah, we must hate America if we insist on correcting lies. After all, lies are what patriotism is built on. If we correct lies, we are attacking the very foundations of patriotism!

There's something very Stephen Colbert about that...

It does make me wonder what a Marine would have to say about any of it.

This is a hideously obvious attempt to get obesebear to use his mod powers on me just because I challenged the belief that the US has won every single war it has ever fought single-handedly and is the sole saviour and protector of Western civilisation to which we are forever indebted.

I do hope he won't fall for it.

I also wish Hermoor was back. I'd like to see what he'd make of all this. You two could have had a competition to see who knows the least about history and geopolitics and who has the most unwarranted jingoistic beliefs.

 

[guitar_dudester91]

No actually, I just wanted to know what his opinion was. And you'er still falling back to hermoor? Wasn't that joke voted stupid a few weeks ago?

 

[obesebear]

Seems I have been beckoned to this thread.  Therefore I shall dispense upon thee my feelings on this matter...

I don't really give a shit about history.

Now then, please continue.

 

[nfitc1]

That's the way capitalism works (it's an overrated system). You, the marketer, make the consumer think that they either can't live without or will be happier with whatever you're trying to sell. In the worst cases, marketers try to convince you that you AREN'T REALLY HAPPY and that their goods can fill a void YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU HAD!! I HATE watching commercials on TV because of that. There have never been informative commercials. They're always trying to show people happier or more successful because they own things. I'm much more socialist anyway. Lots of people in the US would love to be socialist. When 90% of a country's wealth is being held by 3% of its population you have an unbalanced system.

American conspicuous consumption, retarded though it is, is what makes the US economy so strong and so conducive to innovation. If people were happy with what they already had, we'd have no need to improve anything. Just look at how much the home PC market has changed in the past 20 years; there's no way that would have been possible if people weren't constantly looking for something better. If it weren't for that American attitude, we'd all still be paying $2000 for desktops with a 1GB HDD. Mass-market laptops probably wouldn't exist.

Sure, some people get exploited, but no-one forces anyone to buy anything. If you're too stupid to see through advertising BS and thus get tricked into spending all your money on things that you don't really want, then you deserve to be a tool for making ambitious business and engineering ventures financially viable.

But the average John Q Public doesn't care about bettering themselves, just making themselves happy. Just as the upper echelon of the country's population has 90% of its wealth, another upper echelon (mostly apart from the rich one) has 90% of its intelligence too. The US's economy is strong by exploiting the weak and feeble-minded into getting things to make them "happy" rather than to make them better people. The nation itself isn't really evolving and this upper intelligence echelon that is in power are really the ones that direct the country's development.

 

[Mako]

Seems I have been beckoned to this thread.  Therefore I shall dispense upon thee my feelings on this matter...

I don't really give a sh*t about history.

Now then, please continue.

Damn you and your super short ninja posts Obesebear! Did you ever stop to think for once, that people (like myself) like to read your posts! :x I think your being stingy

If I may be so bold here, I see this thread has words like: "ninnies" and "jackwagon" and even "upper echelon" now I hate to get all your hopes up but...
WHO THE HELL KNOWS WHO DID WHAT!. After the wikileaks documentation was released who knows what really goes on behind the scenes, all of you only go by what little is released in the media or internet. Point is pride, I would incite a massive flame war if I said "US would wipe the whole of Europe off the face of the globe without breaking a sweat!" would I be right? probably. But that would mean less for us (USA) decreasing our "power" as a country. We are a global economy we NEED each other, no country can stand alone, every country needs to import and export from other country/s.

NO COUNTRY HAS THE POWER TO STAND ALONE.

So calm down peeps the song is just your typical US propaganda, every country has one or two.

 

[Covarr]

So calm down peeps

This is one of the best posts I've ever seen in a political thread on any forum ever.

I've noticed that when politics are involved, folks have a tendency to get angry if you simply disagree with them. This whole thread is filled with name-calling and aggression. Honestly, you embarrass yourselves when you behave like this. Besides, the vast majority of people who argue about politics have NO IDEA how any of it works, or what actually goes on in various offices.

In the US, the loudest Democrats (such as Bill Maher) despise George W Bush, speak out with contempt against him, treat him as either the most evil or the most stupid president ever to live. The loudest Republicans (such as Bill O'Reilly) do the same for Barack Obama. But these presidents, no matter how different their views, would never say something like this about each other. They understand the efforts that each other have put in, the difficulty of the work, and they realize that even though they have different opinions on what the country needs, they're both trying to do what they feel is right.

These guys know how to behave in a respectful manner. Let's see if we can follow that example.

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

No actually, I just wanted to know what his opinion was.

Sure you were ;D

And you'er still falling back to hermoor? Wasn't that joke voted stupid a few weeks ago?

I don't recall a democratic election. Not that it would matter if there were one; comparing someone to Hermoor is still this forum's equivalent of comparing someone to Hitler.

I don't really give a sh*t about history

But you should know better than that, bear-kun. You've been to the Middle-East, right? What's going on in that part of the world is a classic example of what happens when history is used as a propaganda tool.

But the average John Q Public doesn't care about bettering themselves, just making themselves happy. Just as the upper echelon of the country's population has 90% of its wealth, another upper echelon (mostly apart from the rich one) has 90% of its intelligence too. The US's economy is strong by exploiting the weak and feeble-minded into getting things to make them "happy" rather than to make them better people. The nation itself isn't really evolving and this upper intelligence echelon that is in power are really the ones that direct the country's development.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

Point is pride, I would incite a massive flame war if I said "US would wipe the whole of Europe off the face of the globe without breaking a sweat!" would I be right? probably.

Any of the established nuclear powers could send any of the others back to the Stone Age. Mutually assured destruction FTW!  ;D

So calm down peeps

This is one of the best posts I've ever seen in a political thread on any forum ever.

I've noticed that when politics are involved, folks have a tendency to get angry if you simply disagree with them. This whole thread is filled with name-calling and aggression. Honestly, you embarrass yourselves when you behave like this. Besides, the vast majority of people who argue about politics have NO IDEA how any of it works, or what actually goes on in various offices.

Pfft. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm just having fun here. It's rare for me to be seriously bothered by arguments on the internet. :mrgreen:

In the US, the loudest Democrats (such as Bill Maher) despise George W Bush, speak out with contempt against him, treat him as either the most evil or the most stupid president ever to live. The loudest Republicans (such as Bill O'Reilly) do the same for Barack Obama. But these presidents, no matter how different their views, would never say something like this about each other. They understand the efforts that each other have put in, the difficulty of the work, and they realize that even though they have different opinions on what the country needs, they're both trying to do what they feel is right.

Sounds boring.

In Britain, leading politicians, including the Prime Minister, openly insult each other, to each others' faces, live on TV. It's very entertaining.

You should start doing that in the US. The ratings would be incredible.

 

[Bosola]

I can't help suspect KM would be far less optimistic about the efficiency of the private sector if he'd worked with some of the 'big guns' as clients. They really aren't the rigorously organized, efficient and entrepreneurial machines you think. And I'm talking about IT - if these guys can't innovate, we're all MAKOed!

But that is a matter for another time, and maybe more concerns large vs small than public vs private.

Oh, and I like how guitar_man_9001 or whatever thinks admins take kindly to some pretty transparent attempts at manipulation. Back in the days I was a moderator (reclines in chair, places pipe in mouth), that usually meant first place on our MAKOlist.

We really didn't appreciate it.

In Britain, leading politicians, including the Prime Minister, openly insult each other, to each others' faces, live on TV. It's very entertaining.

One caveat, though - an MP can't call another politician a liar. He might say 'economical with the truth', or cast aspersions on his opponent's 'research', but can't *actually* claim deceit.

Not that even these 'workarounds' get used much in practice; the public just doesn't really care. I suppose we just sort of assume politicians are a bunch of MAKOs right from the off, so we can only then be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Mako]

Hmmm why are using my name Bosola? In such a weird fashion? It's almost as if the "badword" filter is using my name instead....

 

[Kudistos Megistos]

I can't help suspect KM would be far less optimistic about the efficiency of the private sector if he'd worked with some of the 'big guns' as clients. They really aren't the rigorously organized, efficient and entrepreneurial machines you think. And I'm talking about IT - if these guys can't innovate, we're all ****ed!

But that is a matter for another time, and maybe more concerns large vs small than public vs private.

Are you talking about dealing with the IT demands of non-IT oriented companies or with actual IT companies? In either case, it's all relative; the public sector's ability to deal with IT is hideous, so I've heard and so I've witnessed. Hell, I hear that the government itself still uses IE6 when it's not losing the personal data of millions of people by leaving USB sticks on the bus.

In Britain, leading politicians, including the Prime Minister, openly insult each other, to each others' faces, live on TV. It's very entertaining.

One caveat, though - an MP can't call another politician a liar. He might say 'economical with the truth', or cast aspersions on his opponent's 'research', but can't *actually* claim deceit.

He might be able to get away with it if he claims to have been "tired and emotional" at the time. ;D

EDIT:

When did Mako's name become a swear word? That's an insult to the poor girl.

 

[Bosola]

Are you talking about dealing with the IT demands of non-IT oriented companies or with actual IT companies? In either case, it's all relative; the public sector's ability to deal with IT is hideous, so I've heard and so I've witnessed. Hell, I hear that the government itself still uses IE6 when it's not losing the personal data of millions of people by leaving USB sticks on the bus.

Trust me, that's far worse than some of the big private sector names do. I mean both non-IT and IT/comms companies.

I'm a bit too paranoid about my employer seeing this to say much specific [tinfoils], but I can say that a major - I mean massive organization - much famed for its 'entrepreneurial drive' - in reality just leaps from catastrophe to catastrophe. And their IT department is a total joke.

PM me if you care for details. Honestly, our public sector clients might be iffy, but *these* guys were something else. Another couple of biggies were pretty poor, too.

He might be able to get away with it if he claims to have been "tired and emotional" at the time.

Or if 'God told him to do it'. Thanks Tone!

When did Mako's name become a swear word? That's an insult to the poor girl.

Oh, MAKO off.

Anyway, it's

* four letters
* FF7-related
* less explicit than calling Tony Blair a 'King Kanute'.